ITP - 116: From Cleveland to China to India (And Still Not Done Yet)

Greg:
Once again, this is Greg. Welcome to the episode. This is Greg the Single Guy and I'm here with Kent the Cat Guy. How you doing, Kent? Ready for some Christmas, aren't you? And also JP is here, but JP is in Canada right now. She fled Mexico for a little bit to be in Canada. What are you doing in Canada, JP?

Kent The Cat Guy:
Great to be here. Thanks, Greg.

I'm all set.

JPMint:
Visiting family and friends and enjoying the snow, the white stuff outside the window. So not stepping out into it, but looking at it. It's beautiful.

Greg:
The joys of retirement, huh Kent? Just get up and go.

Kent The Cat Guy:
You know, JP might work harder than both of us combined.

Greg:
And she does, we know that. That's why she's the boss. But listen, enough about us. We're really excited to present to you our new guest. Our guest is coming in from New Delhi, India, Tamisha Shantel. Welcome to the show.

Kent The Cat Guy:
Woo!

JPMint:
Wee!

Temisha Shantel:
Yay, I'm here. I finally made it.

JPMint:
Hahaha.

Greg:
I hear you've been listening to a few of our episodes. Is that true?

Temisha Shantel:
You know, actually JP did force me. She kept sending these links to me. That's kind of how I ended up here.

Greg:
At gunpoint, yeah.

Wow. Well, speaking of being here, can you give us a little bit of an elevator version of your journey through education and how you landed there?

Temisha Shantel:
This is actually, and it sounds weird to say sometimes, but this is my 28th year. So I've taught for 12 years in the States, in Cleveland, Ohio, in the inner city. I've done a little bit of everything from curriculum specialist to classroom teacher, so a little bit of everything.

And then in 2018, I moved to Shanghai, China, where I was a reading coach and a grade five classroom teacher. Then I started EAL my second year there and I continued in EAL even after moving to India. So this is my third year here in India.

Greg:
You're doing a great job with English.

You speak really well for an EAL student. Or do you mean, wait, you taught EAL. I'm sorry. That's right.

JPMint:
Ha.

Temisha Shantel:
I do teach EAL and it is something I enjoy. This year, well for the past three years, I have been first grade EAL, but I've done everything from grade K to five under EAL.

Greg:
Bless your heart. First grade teachers are so special. They really are. Fourth grade teachers are a dime a dozen, right Kent? But first grade teachers...

Kent The Cat Guy:
Yeah, you can get them off the street.

Temisha Shantel:
But hey, everything from K to 8, so I respect it all.

Greg:
Well, once we get up there in the years, between the four of us, I think we counted at some point, we're almost at 100 years between us in education. It just shows that when a kid asks, what did you teach, you're like, what haven't I taught after a while, right? So good for you, that's great.

Roll back a little bit. You're Cleveland, Ohio, right?

Temisha Shantel:
Originally from Mississippi, but once I graduated from university, I moved to Ohio. And that's where I actually got all of my experience. I was in the same school district for 21 years.

Greg:
Well, I have to shout out Cleveland Browns fans because Cleveland fans are second only to Green Bay Packer fans. You guys lost your team for a while. I don't talk a lot about football, but the fan base for Cleveland has always been so good. They lasted three years without them until they got them back. Hats off to you guys, but not quite Packer fans.

JPMint:
Tamisha, can you tell us how you learned about international teaching? If you were in Ohio just moseying along in the district, how did you learn there is this thing called international teaching?

Greg:
Good question.

Temisha Shantel:
I always tell people that when I reflect back on this, I wonder the same thing. I just remember around 2010, I started telling people that I was going to move abroad. Mind you, I was married at that time, my daughter was in school, but I just knew that I wanted to move abroad.

I knew that I was going to move to Dubai for some reason.

Greg:
Wow. You're just like, I'm going to Dubai. That's it.

Temisha Shantel:
At that time, that is exactly the way it was. People would ask, what are you going to do? And I'm like, I don't know, I just know that I'm moving overseas. Anybody who knows me knows that if I say I'm going to do something, I'm going to do it. And the worst thing you can do is doubt me because then it fuels me to prove you wrong.

As time went on, that was like 2010, I didn't move overseas until 2018. Things just evolved and changed in my life. I never stopped dreaming, but I constantly shelved the dream.

I pulled it back off the shelf in 2012, put it back, pulled it again in 2016 or 2017. That’s when I really started to hear people talk about teaching abroad, but I heard a lot of people saying the benefits weren’t great, the pay was low, and they talked about teaching English.

In my head I was thinking there has to be something more than teaching English. Surely there are real schools abroad.

So I started researching more. I used social media, even though I fought against it forever. I didn’t join Facebook until 2016 and didn’t join Instagram until 2020. But when I joined, I used it to network.

I started finding expats and educator groups and realized this is a real world out here. In 2017, I was offered the opportunity to interview in Dubai in April.

I talked myself out of it because I thought I wouldn’t be able to sell both of my homes, deal with my vehicle, resign properly, or tie up loose ends.

But by July, I was eating, sleeping, and breathing living abroad. I knew I had to either do it or stop talking about it.

[End of Chunk 1]

Greg:
Well, it's interesting because how did you end up going overseas? You bypassed the chance to go to the UAE interview. Did they want you in person?

Temisha Shantel:
I would have interviewed with the school on Zoom, so it would have been online. But again, I declined because it hit so suddenly. This is what I've talked about for years, but I just kind of talked myself out of it.

Greg:
Because it was real. Yeah, it was real at the time. The reason I ask is because how did you end up interviewing for something overseas then?

Temisha Shantel:
So like I said, by July I was eating, sleeping, and breathing moving abroad. I connected with different people. I started to find out about international schools. I started to find out about the benefits and the life you had the opportunity to live compared to the U.S.

I got in contact with a few recruiting agencies that people suggested, like Teach Away and Teach Anywhere. But the position I ended up with in Shanghai was actually one I applied for directly because I also started researching schools independently of those agencies.

In November, I signed up to go to a Teach Away fair in Atlanta. I went to the fair and received a few offers there from Kuwait and a couple from the UAE. I ended up turning those down because I believe that what's meant for me will come.

I continued to research schools and did a direct apply to the school in Shanghai where I accepted the job. It's funny because I was contacted in January about interviewing, and when I received the email, I was like, is this a scam?

Greg:
Right, how do you trust it?

Kent The Cat Guy:
Yep.

JPMint:
Really?

Temisha Shantel:
I had actually applied to them, but when you get that email with foreign characters and someone saying they’re the principal and they’ve reviewed your CV, you start wondering if it's real. He asked about setting up an interview.

I responded and agreed. His assistant reached out within 24 hours, and within 48 hours I was interviewing. Mind you, I interviewed at like 3 a.m. because of the time difference.

Greg:
For the time difference. Pajamas on the bottom, proper attire on the top.

JPMint:
I don’t know anything about that.

Temisha Shantel:
You have your cute scarf on and your lipstick. Well, Greg and Kent may not know anything about the lipstick, but yeah.

Kent The Cat Guy:
Hahaha!

JPMint:
No, Kent’s all about that.

Greg:
Are you kidding?

Kent The Cat Guy:
Tamisha, I know you’re not done with how you got that first job, but what was your family’s reaction when this became real?

Temisha Shantel:
I remember when I really got deep into this and went to the job fair, I told my mom about the offers. She said it was good but didn’t want to talk about it right then. That’s a mom. She was supportive, but it was hard for her.

I think she was a little relieved when I didn’t accept those first offers. My dad kept asking, are you sure this is what you want to do? Because it’s far away. And of course, that just fuels me.

Greg:
Do you remember what schools or countries those offers were from?

Temisha Shantel:
At the Teach Away fair, I got two offers in Kuwait and two in the UAE, one in Dubai and one in Abu Dhabi. At that time, those were the places everyone wanted to go.

Kuwait was more of a starting point for teachers, and then they would pivot elsewhere. So both places had their purpose.

Greg:
And you still turned them down. That’s wild.

Temisha Shantel:
And keep in mind, I had been saying since 2010 that I was going.

[End of Chunk 2]

JPMint:
Tamisha, you were getting these offers and eventually the Shanghai opportunity. What steps did you take to prepare yourself for that move? You mentioned houses and cars. What did that process look like between accepting and actually leaving?

Temisha Shantel:
After the interview, I remember my former principal messaging me a few hours later saying someone from a school in China had contacted her about me. Then my current principal said the same thing. That’s when it really hit me like, okay, this is real.

A few days later, I got another email saying they wanted to make me an offer and begin onboarding as soon as possible. Hearing that made it even more real. They told me to take time to think about it, but also that the onboarding process would be long.

So I started making lists. I’m a list person. I had to think about everything. Retirement accounts, banking, changing addresses, checking my 403B, figuring out what would happen with my sick days because I had over 120 days saved up. In Cleveland, they pay those out, so I needed to confirm how that would work.

I had to think about resigning, selling my homes, my car, everything. It was a lot. I just started checking things off one by one.

Greg:
That’s a long list.

Temisha Shantel:
It really was. And on top of my personal list, there was the professional onboarding list. Getting into China is no joke. There were FBI checks, document authentication, medical checks, everything. It felt never ending, but it was exciting.

It took me a couple weeks to break the news to my parents. I dropped hints first, but I already knew I was going. When I did the interview, something felt right. Even after I got off Zoom, I remember saying a prayer because it just felt like this was where I was supposed to go.

Greg:
Intuition.

Temisha Shantel:
Yes. And later, my aunt told me I was following a path that was already set for me. That stuck with me.

Greg:
How long did they give you to accept the offer?

Temisha Shantel:
They didn’t rush me. It wasn’t a 24-hour decision. They told me to read everything, take my time, ask questions, and let them know when I was ready so we could start onboarding. That made a difference because I never felt pressured.

JPMint:
Did they connect you with teachers at the school before you accepted?

Temisha Shantel:
Yes. I interviewed with the principal, the high school principal, and two elementary teachers. One of them was the ELA department chair. Then they paired me with a buddy to support me.

Greg:
So it was a full panel interview?

Temisha Shantel:
Yes, it was a panel.

Greg:
Those can be intimidating. I remember doing one with eight people on a single camera. It was overwhelming.

Temisha Shantel:
It can be, but I always tell interviewers I’m passionate about what I do. If I start rambling, just let me know. When I talk about teaching, the words just flow, so it felt natural.

Kent The Cat Guy:
We need a red light for Greg when he talks too much.

Greg:
That’s fair.

[End of Chunk 3]

Kent The Cat Guy:
Tamisha, can you tell us a little bit about life and teaching in China? Was it Taiwan or was it China? I know it's Shanghai.

Temisha Shantel:
In Shanghai. And I always tell people I loved my life there. I loved China until China didn't love me anymore, and I say that because of the last lockdown in 2022. I experienced that lockdown.

I moved to Shanghai in August 2018 and it was just, wow. It felt like Mary Tyler Moore getting off the airplane. If I had a hat, I probably would have thrown it in the air.

JPMint:
Go check it out on YouTube, we’re showing our age.

Greg:
For our younger listeners, Mary Tyler Moore was an old TV show from the seventies.

Temisha Shantel:
But that’s really how it felt. Even before that, just being in the airport in Detroit and hearing the gate agents speaking Chinese, I thought, I’m really doing this.

Greg:
After all those years, you’re doing it.

Kent The Cat Guy:
I love hearing this through your eyes because every international teacher remembers that first moment when everything feels new.

Temisha Shantel:
From 2018 to 2020, it was amazing. Even during the first part of COVID, life was still pretty normal except we couldn’t leave the country. But everything else was okay.

I stayed two additional years, but by June 2021, I had already made up my mind that even if I was offered another contract, that would be my last year.

In September 2021, I was offered another contract along with a pandemic bonus and a re-signing bonus. I turned all of that down because I knew it was time to leave.

Kent The Cat Guy:
So you didn’t have another job lined up when you turned that down?

Temisha Shantel:
No, I didn’t. My mom always told me, you can always come back home. She said it jokingly, but I knew she meant it.

Kent The Cat Guy:
Can Greg and I stay at your mom’s house just in case?

JPMint:
Can we go home too?

Temisha Shantel:
You would have amazing food. I’m from Mississippi, so southern hospitality.

JPMint:
That’s something new teachers don’t always realize. Sometimes you leave without another job lined up. How did that feel for you?

Temisha Shantel:
It was scary. I had not seen my family since January 2020, and by June 2021, I still didn’t know when borders would open.

I had to decide between family and job. And even though I wanted to stay abroad, I knew I couldn’t keep going without seeing my family.

Between September and December, I applied to about 30 to 35 jobs. Some didn’t respond. Some I interviewed for multiple times and still didn’t get offers.

So imagine going into Christmas with no job, and then into the New Year still without one.

Kent The Cat Guy:
That’s rough.

Temisha Shantel:
That’s why I tell people, hiring season starts early, around October. Get your applications in early, but don’t expect immediate results. You might not have a job in November or even March.

Greg:
That is great advice.

Kent The Cat Guy:
Yeah.

Greg:
It’s a different process from teaching in the States. There’s an ebb and flow to international hiring.

Temisha Shantel:
Exactly. And I always tell people, just because you don’t have a job by March doesn’t mean you won’t get one. Don’t give up.

Sometimes positions reopen later because people change their minds. So stay patient.

JPMint:
I always tell my clients the same thing. It’s a year-long process. There are highs and lows, like a roller coaster.

Temisha Shantel:
And I also try to be real with people. Life abroad is amazing, but we work hard. It’s not just brunches and travel like social media makes it seem.

During the 2022 lockdown, I was locked in my compound for about 70 days. For over 45 of those days, we couldn’t even leave our apartments except to take COVID tests.

Greg:
You’re a guest in another country. You follow their rules.

Temisha Shantel:
Exactly. The government sent us food rations. The compound gates were chained. People don’t understand that reality.

So I always tell people, leave your home country mindset behind. Learn the rules and laws of the country you’re moving to and be ready to follow them.

JPMint:
That’s powerful.

[End of Chunk 4]

JPMint:
Tamisha, you're very wise. I'm loving this conversation because we're getting to know that first move abroad through your eyes. Can you tell us how you found India? You decided not to stay in China, you didn’t have a job in December, still nothing in January. Where did India come in?

Temisha Shantel:
At that time, China’s borders were still closed. They didn’t open until months after I left. I actually left about 30 days early. I was supposed to leave in July 2022, but I left in June.

So I didn’t have a job in December or January. Where I am now is New Delhi, and I’m at American Embassy School. Let me give them a shoutout.

Kent The Cat Guy:
Woohoo!

JPMint:
Beautiful campus, very green.

Temisha Shantel:
I actually applied to American Embassy School in 2020 and never got an interview. Then I applied again in 2021 and had two interviews, but was told they wouldn’t move forward.

I responded and thanked them and said it just wasn’t my time.

Then I applied again in 2022. This was my third time applying. I received an email from my current assistant principal asking to chat.

At first I didn’t even realize it was the same school. After I sent my response, it hit me, this is American Embassy School. I immediately followed up, and they responded saying we had spoken before.

They set up interviews. I had multiple interviews with the principal, assistant principal, and team leads. It felt good.

They checked my references and even followed up when they couldn’t reach one of them. That reference was on Chinese New Year break, but she came through for me.

A few days later, I checked my spam folder and saw an email that said “Say yes to AES.” I thought it was spam, but it was my offer.

Kent The Cat Guy:
Your acceptance email was in spam.

JPMint:
Oh my gosh.

Greg:
That’s going to be the title of the episode.

Temisha Shantel:
It was February 2022. I signed the contract and went through onboarding during lockdown. I was told to send my passport to Beijing for my visa, but something told me not to. Two weeks later, we were locked down. If I had sent it, I don’t know when I would have gotten it back.

Greg:
You dodged a bullet.

Temisha Shantel:
The onboarding process was stressful because I had to do everything during lockdown. Even getting a medical check required permission from neighborhood authorities.

To go to the hospital, I had to justify why I needed to go. I said my blood pressure was high. A neighbor had to get permission to drive me because there were no taxis.

When we came back, we were told we had to do five days of silence because we had left the compound. That meant we couldn’t leave our apartments.

Kent The Cat Guy:
That sounds intense.

Temisha Shantel:
It was. But people in my community helped. That’s something I’ll always remember.

Kent The Cat Guy:
What was it like arriving in India compared to your first time in China?

Temisha Shantel:
I was just as excited and nervous. But China will always hold a special place in my heart because it was my first experience.

Greg:
Do you speak any other languages?

Temisha Shantel:
Not really. Maybe I can order food. But Google Translate and supportive colleagues help a lot.

Greg:
That’s part of the experience.

Temisha Shantel:
Exactly. And I always encourage people who apologize for their English. I remind them they’re doing great.

Greg:
You’ve got a great spirit. Where are you headed next?

Temisha Shantel:
So, I knew when I started this current school year that it would probably be my last here. In September, when contracts came out, I decided to resign.

That’s where JP comes in. She helped me with my CV, cover letter, and interview prep.

I applied for a position September 30th, interviewed October 2nd, and then I got an offer.

Greg:
Where are you going?

Temisha Shantel:
Vietnam. I’m heading to Hanoi, to Concordia.

Kent The Cat Guy:
Congratulations!

JPMint:
So exciting.

Greg:
That’s fantastic.

Temisha Shantel:
I actually held onto the news for a few weeks before telling colleagues. When I finally told them, they were shocked it all happened so early.

Greg:
That’s the best part. You can focus on your current students without worrying.

Kent The Cat Guy:
Or stop going to meetings.

Greg:
That too.

Temisha Shantel:
Right now I’m preparing for the long trip home to see my family, especially my daughter and granddaughters.

Kent The Cat Guy:
Those long flights are tough.

JPMint:
Compression socks are the secret.

Greg:
We’re just about at time. Kent, want to bring us home?

Kent The Cat Guy:
We could do multiple episodes with Tamisha. You have to come back when you're in Vietnam.

Temisha Shantel:
I will.

Greg:
I’m almost speechless. This has been an incredible story and valuable for listeners.

JPMint:
I got goosebumps hearing this. We definitely want you back.

Kent The Cat Guy:
Tamisha, final thoughts?

Temisha Shantel:
Don’t get discouraged. Don’t give up. Don’t rush. Life abroad is amazing, but it’s still life.

Kent The Cat Guy:
Thank you to our guest, Tamisha Shantel, and to my co-hosts Greg and JP Mint. See you next time.

Greg:
That was so much fun.

JPMint:
So good.

Kent The Cat Guy:
And I'm Kent the Cat Guy. As always, you can find me in room 303. See you next time.

Greg:
Vietnam's on the way, right? You're awesome.

Kent The Cat Guy:
Yeah, I love that.

JPMint:
So good.

[End of transcript]