ITP - 061: Teacher Burnout, Wellbeing, and Wealth

Greg: Welcome to the International Teacher Podcast with your host, Matt the Family Guy, Kent the Cat Guy, and me, Greg the Single Guy. We are recording episodes from around the globe to tell you about the best kept secret in education. That's right, it's teaching overseas. We're glad to have you join us.

Greg: All right, welcome to this episode of the International Teacher Podcast. Kent is in Seattle doing—I don't know what. His cat is probably going crazy without him because of cats here in the Middle East. He and Carla, his wife, are in Seattle. But I have a wonderful guest on here right now. Her name is Sybil Hall. She's coming in from Colorado, I believe. She's been an international teacher and she has so much to offer that I just had to get her on this show. So welcome to our show, Sybil.

Sybil: Thanks so much for having me. I'm so glad to be here.

Greg: I love the fact that you've been overseas. I was hoping that you could give us an elevator version of your international teacher experiences leading up to what you're doing now.

Sybil: Yeah, I have spent 12 of my 23 years overseas in amazing international schools. It is the best kept secret, right? When you're out there in it, it's a small community. It doesn't feel like a secret at all. It's quite competitive and there are so many amazing people. But when you come back to the U.S., you're like, nobody knows about it. So it’s the most amazing teaching experience ever.

I started overseas. My first job was in Rome, Italy at the American Overseas School of Rome. That was pre-kids. We had only taught three years and we were like, let’s go do this. Let’s get into Europe and just travel.

We went to Rome for two years and we did not come back to the States during that time. My husband is also a teacher, and it was actually his first year teaching. He’s a science teacher. I was a kindergarten and first grade teacher at the time. We loved our time there, traveled all of Europe, went down to Egypt, things like that.

Then we decided we wanted to go back to the U.S., have a couple of kids near grandparents and family, and then take our kids back out because we realized this is an amazing experience no matter where you are in life—pre-kids, during kids, after kids. People do it after they retire.

So we spent eight years back in the U.S. teaching and raising kids. I was very fortunate to work part-time. We had very little money, but we bought a small starter home, worked part-time, raised the kids, and then we hit the road again.

So we were out for 10 years on our next stint. We went to Shanghai, China, to Shanghai American School for five years. It was just an incredible experience. The best professional learning experience—I could never even imagine how much I would get to learn and all the opportunities there.

I went as a kindergarten teacher, but I moved into an instructional coaching position. That was amazing. Then we moved to Dubai to the American School of Dubai for two years. I was the tech and innovation coach in the elementary school there.

Then we really wanted to get back to Europe. Our kids were entering their teenage years, and we decided that we would move to Brussels, to the International School of Brussels, and spent three years there. That was during the pandemic, which actually ended up being an amazing place to be. We had a lot of freedom to go outdoors, go on walks, and things like that.

Then we’ve just recently repatriated, just about a year ago, actually last summer, back to Colorado. Our kids really wanted the high school experience in the U.S. I know it sounds kind of funny because they are at these incredible schools, but they want to go to university here. So we’re temporarily back in the U.S. for about three years. My son will graduate in three years, and then who knows—we’ll probably hit the road again. We kind of have emerging plans of partially retiring in the U.S. and maybe Portugal or Panama or something like that.

I hope you don’t ask me where I want to retire because first of all, I don’t want to retire. I’m getting closer and closer to that age. I’m like 54 now. And I had a conversation with a school leader about retirement, right? I couldn’t believe I was actually doing that.

Greg: You have been in so many places. You mentioned Rome, then back to Colorado, then Shanghai, then Dubai, then Brussels. Wow, what a great journey. I mean, you’re going to have to hit South America next.

Sybil: Exactly. We haven’t been to Central or South America yet.

Greg: Let’s put that on your map of countries to do pretty soon.

Sybil: Yeah, for sure. There’s so much beautiful, so many beautiful things to see down there.

Greg: Actually, if you want to, you can just go to Miami, and if you go near the airport, it’s Little Venezuela. I just went home for about 12 days to check out mom and dad and hang out with a friend of mine I hadn’t seen in 10 years because I’ve been in so many different schools and places.

The funniest thing was that when I got there and we were hanging out in Little Venezuela areas and going to restaurants and drinking Venezuelan beer and stuff, he went into translator mode. So he went up and ordered beers for me, and I was like, I didn’t do anything. I’m in my own country. He’s also from the States, but he’s fluent in both Spanish and Venezuelan Spanish, and I was like, I’m not going to be talking in English. He went into translator mode.

It took me a moment. I was like, what’s going on? Why are you translating? I’m like, dude, what is happening?

Greg: I haven’t done the thing where you repatriate for a couple of years and have a family and then come back. It’s a very popular thing to do, and I know a lot of our listeners are overseas teaching already or thinking about it.

When you went back the first time, what was that like?

Sybil: That’s a great question. People told us if we went back home, we would never go back out. We were like, absolutely not. We really look at our life one year at a time. It’s a cool way to live it. We have the big picture, but it’s like one year at a time.

So we really lived the American dream when we went home. We were young. We were like, we’re going to have kids. So we bought our first home. We loved our garage and our washer and dryer—things we didn’t have in Italy.

So you kind of like the experience in Italy was amazing for what it was, and then there were these things in the United States that we could really enjoy too. So we fell back into it pretty easily.

I think the biggest thing is the transition from an international school back to a U.S. public school, which we have done intentionally both times we moved back home. That has been working in the public schools again, and that’s for the retirement benefits.

I know some people when they repatriate end up working at an independent school, and I don’t blame them because there are a lot of big differences. But for us, it was important that we were back in the public system so we could build up that retirement that we leave behind when we go overseas.

So I would say that was the biggest adjustment—going from a small independent school overseas to a public school here in the U.S.

Greg: I do have to interject here and just go back to one thing you said. You were living in Italy, went back to the States, and a washer and dryer. We do have to make sure that the listeners don’t think that Italians don’t have washers and dryers.

Sybil: Right. They’re really tiny and you don’t always have a dryer. We did not have a dryer, and our jeans would be hanging outside drying. If it rained, you started that two-day process all over again.

Greg: I don’t know about you, but I am a little bit bigger than the average Italian, and I couldn’t find any clothes in Italy if I did ruin something that I was washing.

Sybil: That’s another story.

Greg: I love it. And I think everything feeds into your book. You’re a new author, and I’m so excited because you did send me a preview of it, and I’ve been reading it. You’re a great author. It dropped me into all these things that we’re talking about.

But here’s one thing—can I quote a little bit from your book?

Sybil: Yes, please feel free.

Greg: You wrote: “For us, traveling back home has become more than just a tradition. It’s a way to grow and find joy in life. It’s an opportunity to escape the mundane and embrace the unexpected. We’re always looking for new hobbies, adventures, and experiences that we can share together.”

People might think that’s backwards, that you are going back home to escape the mundane. But to me, living overseas, I totally agree with you. Going back home is getting away from the same day-to-day life.

Sybil: Yeah, isn’t that interesting? It’s such a unique perspective that we have as international teachers. My expectations overseas—I don’t have expectations. I’m just pleasantly surprised when something works because I don’t know what to expect most of the time.

When I go back to the States, I have these high expectations that things are going to work. But slowly, that’s changing too.

Greg: Can we talk about your book?

Sybil: Yeah, absolutely. And it’s funny you mentioned Andrew Hallam because he is the reason I started building wealth. When I found his book Millionaire Teacher nine years ago or something like that, it really changed everything for me.

I didn’t think I would ever be an author. I’m not the kind of person who, as a kid, loved writing and thought I would be an author. But I went through a transformation during COVID in the Belgian forest. That transformation had to do with the writing of my book.

We started talking about repatriating and coming back to the States. I absolutely love teaching. I absolutely love being an instructional coach. I did that for eight years overseas. I love making an impact and serving others, serving teachers so they can better serve their students.

But COVID was really hard on all of us. It was incredible to be overseas and to watch friends in different countries and how unique and different their experiences were. That could be a whole separate conversation.

I was in a situation where we were teaching from home, like everyone else. I found joy in that in many ways, and I found a lot of stress in that. I was suddenly on all the time.

I knew I wanted to do something different while still helping teachers and people. So I decided I wanted to write a book.

I found a book coach who actually worked with me in Shanghai. I got fascinated by the idea that I could still be a teacher and a coach in a different way.

So I pushed myself and challenged myself to see if I could write a book. I had no idea what I was going to write about at first. I thought maybe it would be a pedagogical book for teachers.

I went out into the Belgian forest and recorded myself talking, using AI to transcribe it. I talked about life in the pandemic and my journeys overseas.

What came out of that was a book about teacher well-being. Writing the book helped me heal, helped me take care of myself, and helped me learn how to teach while taking care of myself.

I went back into the classroom in June 2020. In Belgium, it was really important to get kids back in school. We left in March and returned in June.

That was a terrifying experience. But when I saw those students, I had about 10 kids across two classrooms. The kids were so grateful to be there and so grateful that I was there.

That reminded me how much they rely on us as teachers. I knew that already, but it hit me in a different way.

That’s when I realized I could have a bigger impact. I decided to tell my stories about finding myself, learning to take care of myself, and include exercises, journaling, and strategies that I could share with others.

My book is called Burn Bright, Not Out: 35 Lessons to Cultivate Teacher Well-Being.

It’s 35 stories from my life and travels and exercises for both teachers and their students.

Greg: I love the structure of your book. You organize it around seasons, and you include mindset moments and activities. It’s really accessible.

Tell me about fail forward.

Sybil: I love that concept. It’s about reframing mistakes as learning opportunities. We all make mistakes, especially when we take risks.

I’ve made so many mistakes. Anyone who puts themselves out there will. Not everyone moves overseas to teach. That takes risk, and risk leads to mistakes.

Another coach and I in Dubai had a chart where we publicly tracked our mistakes and what we learned from them.

That was transformational for us and for others who saw it.

I challenge people to write down their mistakes for a week and reflect on them.

Greg: I think a lot of us share mistakes verbally, but writing them down helps people who struggle to process them.

Sybil: Exactly.

Greg: Two feathers and a rock.

Sybil: Two positives and one challenge from your day. We do it as a family. It creates balance and connection.

Greg: That reminds me of the sandwich method.

Sybil: Yes, very similar.

Greg: Accountability partners.

Sybil: Huge. Sharing goals makes them real. It helps you stay committed.

Greg: I recently started doing that with a friend. We check in monthly on health goals.

Sybil: Breaking big goals into small steps and sharing them is key.

Greg: I even had students hold me accountable once.

Sybil: That works too.

Greg: Let’s take a quick break.

Greg: You can find us on Instagram and Twitter at ITPExpats. Email us at [internationalteacherpodcast@gmail.com](mailto:internationalteacherpodcast@gmail.com) or visit [www.itpexpats.com](http://www.itpexpats.com).

Greg: Back to the show.

Greg: Do you reflect on your day after school?

Sybil: Absolutely. My mind races. That’s why nature is so important. I go into the forest, clear my mind, and reset.

That allows me to be present with my family. Otherwise, they would get the worst version of me.

Greg: I’ve always wondered how teachers with kids do it.

Sybil: That transition time is critical.

Greg: Your book ties all of this together.

Sybil: It does.

Greg: Let’s talk about financial well-being.

Sybil: Before Andrew Hallam, I already had an entrepreneurial mindset. I started a couponing blog and taught myself HTML. I taught university classes at night.

When we moved to Shanghai, our salaries increased. That’s when I started investing in index funds.

We also bought an investment property that generates passive income.

Greg: That’s huge.

Sybil: That led me to build the Wealth and Well-Being Collective.

Greg: What are you doing now?

Sybil: I’m mentoring with the Modern Classroom Project and working as an international literacy consultant. I’ve worked in places like the Dominican Republic.

I’m also building an online business. I ran a beta course for teachers to explore passions and side gigs.

Now I’m building a membership model that is scalable and allows me to reduce work hours while still helping teachers.

Greg: That’s smart.

Sybil: My goal is balance—less work time, more life, while still making an impact.

Greg: Where can people find you?

Sybil: [www.sybilhall.com](http://www.sybilhall.com). You can also join my book launch team there.

Greg: Do you have a travel or customs story?

Sybil: At the airport in Dubai, security asked me if I had been at a camel farm because of a photo on my phone.

Greg: That’s great.

Greg: I had a customs issue once where a passport wasn’t stamped, and we had to sort it out at the border. Took about an hour.

Sybil: Those moments become part of the experience.

Greg: Anything else you want to share?

Sybil: I just hope the book helps teachers. It’s vulnerable to put it out there, but I want it to inspire people.

I also believe strongly in staying connected to nature and helping kids do the same.

Greg: I saw a family in an airport recently—all on their phones, not talking. It really stuck with me.

Sybil: It’s important to stay present.

Greg: Your book brings all of this together. Thanks for joining us.

Sybil: Thank you so much. It’s been a pleasure.

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